Megaloptera spit out from Neuroptera?

What's the latest on this?

I found this forum while trying to figure out what the deal is with Raphidiodea. I imagine there has been discussion since, but this seemed like as good a place as any to seek clarification: On what basis does BugGuide have Raphidiodea and Megaloptera as suborders, rather than as separate orders? If Nearctica is the standard (other than for moths and spiders and dragonflies), they should both be their own orders. This is also the arrangement used by ITIS, which says their latest review of this was 2007. Is this another one of those things (like Collembola etc.) that is just deemed too much of a pain to fix, and will be fixed when the next version of BugGuide comes around?

… Charley Eiseman, 8 October, 2008 - 6:26pm

I don't know what the "offici

I don't know what the "official" stance is, but it seems terrestrial entomologists tend to lump them in Neuroptera. Talk to an aquatic entomologist, and they all say Megaloptera (the aquatic neuroptera) are elevated to order.

… Dennis Profant, 11 September, 2005 - 11:32pm

OK, I'm feeling rather terrestrial

Well, I've always felt rather terrestrial in my outlook. Furthermore, I see not reason to split unless it is really helpul in making identifications, which this would not be. (Neuroptera is a rather small order already.) So I see no reason to move Megaloptera out of neuroptera. Sounds good.

Patrick Coin
Durham, North Carolina

… Cotinis, 12 September, 2005 - 8:59am

consistency needed

I think we should either:
1. create the suborders Planipennia, Megaloptera, and Raphidoidea within Neuroptera
or
2. split out Megaloptera as a separate order (like Raphidioptera already is)

Currently, we have the snakeflies in their own order, and the alderflies/dobsonflies/fishflies floating loose in Neuroptera - a half-split & half-lumped arrangement which seems sort of half-baked to me.

… Robin McLeod, 26 October, 2005 - 1:59pm

Neuroptera orders, suborders

Well, things are pretty much 3/4 baked now. I put Megaloptera and Planipennia in as suborders of Neuroptera. We still have snakeflies as their own order, but I don't want to disturb somebody else's work.

Opinions from the group? As I said, I like the suborder idea, because there are already so many orders, and the Neuroptera are a well-known, traditional groupage of related families. The use of suborders seems to maintain the relationships represnted by having orders for Megaloptera and the others.

Patrick Coin
Durham, North Carolina

… Cotinis, 7 January, 2006 - 10:41am

I like suborders

For what my opinion is worth, I like the idea of suborders within Neuroptera. There are so many orders already, I can't see creating more if there are valid classifications using suborders.

For what that's all worth...

And I say go ahead and do it if you have good authority to reference for it. Again, just my opinion.

Patrick Coin
Durham, North Carolina

… Cotinis, 28 October, 2005 - 9:36pm

You know how the biology worl

You know how the biology world is, full of lumpers vs splitters. I personally do not split them, but that's only because I was taught that way years ago. If everybody eventually splits, then so shall I.

… Dennis Profant, 12 September, 2005 - 2:27pm