ID Request cleanup: seeking consensus

you can move aculeates from ID request as necessary

to frass or to bees (Anthophila) or family (etc.) guide pages (I now check these more often than before)

… John S. Ascher, 7 November, 2009 - 2:00pm

thanks for the helpful input

… v belov, 7 November, 2009 - 2:04pm

Spiders

John and I have a system for unidentified spiders. Anything in "Spiders - Spiders (Araneae)" is generally something we need to look at again or confirm. From there if we know the family we move it there, if we think it's not needed we frass it. If we can't ID it to family we moved it to Entelegynes (rarely Haplogynes or Mygalomorphs). So Entelygynes is our holdig bin for most unidentified spiders. It is very helpful to have a place for images you've looked at, couldn't ID but don't want to frass. That way you aren't wading through images you've already looked at. I'm not sure how this would work with other parts of the guide, but if necessary I think we could create no-taxon pages for this purpose.

… Lynette Elliott, 29 September, 2009 - 10:22am

most helpful input, Lynette

I don’t know if I added any headache for you by dumping too many spider pix from ID Request to the Araneae page; I apologize if I did. I saw a lot of apparently common and identified species but, as an ignorant outsider, couldn't decide which ones are frassable, so I thought I’d rather leave it all to you spider connoisseurs in one place. I hope I didn’t cause too much trouble and extra work.
Also, if you instruct me so, I can move stuff to the Entelygynes [rather than Araneae] level from now on; I guess I’m etntelygent enough to manage.
No-taxon ‘interim storage’ pages: I've been making such pages to keep pix where I still see some potential after an expert failed to put a name on the image. They are a handy tool. Examples can be found in Tachinidae and Meloidae.

… v belov, 29 September, 2009 - 3:20pm

Moving to Spiders (Araneae)

from ID request is exactly the right thing to do. That way everything gets looked at a second time (hopefully by a different person). Spiders we are sure of (and know we want to keep) are moved immediately (usually). Other images just need more thought, research, etc. I would not recommend moving anything to Entelygynes since it would likely be a long time before we revisit those images. Entelygynes is more of a holding bin for spiders we think should be IDable, but we can't even place to family. It would be best if only John Balaban or I moved images to Entelygynes at this time.

… Lynette Elliott, 29 September, 2009 - 4:37pm

good to know, thanks!

I've been afraid to move spiders from ID Request at all, I know you guys have rigorous standards for identification and image quality.

("You guys" in the Northeastern sense of the word, "you and another person or people of either or both genders." My coworkers from the South think it's weird, is it a Northeastern thing?)

… Abigail Parker, 29 September, 2009 - 8:49pm

You guys

Is a term I've always used in the Northwest. Maybe it's just a northern thing?

… Lynette Elliott, 30 September, 2009 - 9:10am

Western too

We say "you guys" in California. In the South, they don't need to. They have "y'all."

… R. Berg, 30 September, 2009 - 11:12am

Grew up hearing and saying "you guys"

in Colorado, Nebraska, and Iowa, but not so much here in New Mexico (though it's not "weird" or unfamiliar to people, they just don't say it as much). The y'all thing is here too. We seem to be on the cusp, neither is common, neither is weird. Or, maybe both are weird, and we just don't know it (talk to our British friends) :o)

… David J. Ferguson, 30 September, 2009 - 1:21pm

....

Y'all is all we hear and say in Oklahoma....except for the out-of-staters.

Definition - short for "you all"....all of you....you and everyone with you....a group....more than one person...."you guys" :-D

… Sam Houston, 28 October, 2009 - 12:12pm

Other regional equivalents:

"Youse", or "youse guys"
"you'uns"

In southern California, "you guys" is the closest we have, though it doesn't sound completely native. I've also heard "you folks".

Of course, most people around here more than a few decades old are either from someplace else or had parents from someplace else (My dad was a native, and my mom is from Iowa).

… Chuck Entz, 7 November, 2009 - 5:23pm

got it

thanks, Lynette

… v belov, 29 September, 2009 - 4:59pm

Hi all

Just had this forum pointed out to me. My opionion on this is that if it is obvious they belong to a certain group (Acrididae, Orthoptera, Dictyoptera, or whatever), and they haven't been commented on for some time while lying in ID Request, go ahead and move them to where it is obvious. I think they are more likely to be noticed (and they can always be frassed from there if appropriate).

I actually spend a lot more time than I should looking through BugGuide, and am perhaps even a bit addicted to it (it is fun). However, time is limited, and I don't spend much going back through older posts under ID Requests (there are just too many). And, I do miss some. So, for me, it's easier to find them (or relocate them) if they are under one of the taxonomic headings.

I do hope to sit down and go through some of the other Orthopteroid categories that have been ignored, and try to identify the majority if I can. I'll tackle them one group at a time - eventually. However, don't wait for me if you know what it is. :-)

I have a tendency to leave things for the posting individual to move to where they belong, but sometimes that never happens. Perhaps I should just go ahead and move (or frass) them??

… David J. Ferguson, 23 September, 2009 - 1:59pm

well, thanks, Dave -- knowing your ways helps a lot :-]

First, it really helps everybody to have valuable images moved immediately to their final destinations –- and, based on my experience, doesn’t slow down the identification process one bit.
Second, to make your life easier, and subject to your approval, I suggest moving images for your review to just two spots: grasshoppers to Acrididae and the rest, to Orthoptera -– this way there will be only two places you'll ever have to check for unidentified images. So from now on we can instruct our contributors to do the same and you won’t have to look in ID Request anymore. [Will save you time for actual identification.]
Mantids, roaches, and sticks will be waiting for you on the appropriate guide pages.

I will also ask Chuck Entz to monitor this thread and incorporate the consensual outcome of the discussion into his article so the editors could refer contributors to it as a de facto guidelines.

… v belov, 23 September, 2009 - 3:18pm

Orthoptera

I usually move the Orthoptera, but I don't have the time at the moment. That might change when (or if) I get internet access at my current Massachusetts residence. Also, I usually wait to move things until Dave Ferguson has made input on the Acrididae. Also, I have a feeling Dr. Ascher does not bother leaving a comment if an image can't be identified. I'd give him a solid month to look at images, then move them. That is kind of 'my' rule anyway. I leave some images in "ID Request" for a month before moving them to "Frass" or the appropriate agreed-upon taxon. Kind of like "Frass" in reverse:-)

… Eric R. Eaton, 23 September, 2009 - 12:40pm

Rule of thumb (down) might be:

Finessing Riddance As Sensible Sacrifice.

… Peter W. Messer, 23 September, 2009 - 8:53pm

thanks, Eric -- makes perfect sense

of course, i also moved to the guide quite a few images with Dave Ferguson's IDs -- just felt uneasy moving the rest before being told what the best interim storage levels are

… v belov, 23 September, 2009 - 12:56pm